I have a description of the problem that clearly indicates it is the
customer doing the dialing. I only used the words "sometimes" and
"occasionally", but didn't clearly state that it happens once in a
period of several days. I have a thousand calls a day coming in on
this PM3. Have you seen what "set console, set debug isdn on, set
debug 0x51" generates?
> Since the PM3 is going to provide debugging info from the telco and
> the actual contents of the PPP session, Lucent (or list people
> potentially) are going to know exactly what is going on during the
> call.
Unless they have heard of this problem before. Unless they can think
of a situation where this might occur. Unless they can start to
eliminate some possibilities before asking for 500MB of debug logs.
And if that's the only way to do it, I will provide the 500MB of debug
logs.. but "and dial the line in question" suggests that the person
I'd be sending them to doesn't even understand _who_ is making the
call.
> Do you know what "NO_CIRCUIT_AVAIL or "NOT end2end ISDN" means from
> the Adtran?
I believe "no circuit available" and "normal clearing" are typical
names for standard ISDN cause codes. "NOT end2end ISDN" appeared when
he dialed an analog number; I think it's pretty obvious what it means.
> Having the exact model of Adtran unit also can be pretty
> helpful -- I think they make at least 3 different TAs.
If Livingston wants that information, I will call the customer and get
it. They did not ask, so this is hardly relevant to whether I am off
base by being annoyed with them.
> We have never had DOSBS problems that I can recall. This is going back to
> 1996 with 5-BRI cards, to today with PM3s. As long as the telco got it
> right, and the user got it right, the PM could get it right.
You seem to have mixed two different problems. This is not a DOSBS
problem. This is an MLPPP problem. Seperately, there is a DOSBS
problem with a different TA. Do you have customers with Courier
I-Modems that are able to connect using DOSBS to a (56k-equipped) PM3?
I doubt it. I believe the I-Modem is at fault; my gripe there is
Livingston using outdated compatability information and refusing to
update the test or (heaven forbid) try to find a workaround.
> (fill in the name of a vendor) can only help you solve a problem if you
> work with them and provide them with useful information. Providing
> marginally useful debugging info that has unknown error codes and then
> expecting a completely useful answer is unreasonable.
It is not, however, unreasonable to expect them to understand the
question. Nor is it unreasonable to expect them to be able to
communicate effectively. "I need more information could you enter."?
This does not fill me with a lot of confidence that, should I capture
a few days' worth of debugging and send it to them, they'll be able to
find what is needed.
> Smacking around support because you find their email formatting not
> to your liking, because of a grammatical error, or because they are
> asking you to help them obtain info that you don't want obtain, is
> kind of slimy.
It probably is, but those are not the reasons I'm "smacking around
support". I'm smacking around support because of the strong aura of
incompetence they radiate. I'm very tired of explaining things three
or four times, with a day's lag between question and answer.
> If you need an answer quickly, pick up the phone.
And wait for a callback. The reason I e-mailed this one was because
it is _not_ an incredibly critical problem. And because having
someone on the phone isn't going to help; it's not something you
diagnose interactively. I needed to send them the logs anyway. I
used the appropriate method of contact in this situation.
> Did you or your customer even see if Adtran has updated firmware for their
> product or speak to a higher up there to see if there is an Adtran issue
> that their lower level support might be clueless about?
The customer tells me that Adtran support told him that his ISP is
hanging up on the second channel, that Adtran only attempts one
connection, and that there is nothing he can do to change this. This
is not adtran-users. My annoyance with them is not the issue here.
Either the PM3 _is_ incorrectly disconnecting him, in which case it
should be fixed, or it is not, in which case I will have some
information for him to take back to Adtran.
> Do you have any other DOSBS customers that are using Netopia, 3Com,
> Ascend, or Motorola equipment that are having problems?
DOSBS is only a problem with the Courier I-Modem, so far as I know.
Although we have a fairly large percentage of ISDN users, the number
that have dual-channel service _and_ use both channels in the way this
guy does is probably very small. Perhaps only him. We don't track
that kind of thing.
Do _you_ have dual-channel ISDN customers with Adtran TAs who are on a
lot with both channels, but share the same line for analog calls and
are frequently dropping/adding the second channel in their MLPPP
bundle? How would you know unless one called with a problem?
I am capturing the debugging output as requested, and I will send it
along. I will be very suprised if this results in a solution.
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